Kanakuk Institute Podcast

Discipleship Part 1

January 02, 2022 Kanakuk Institute Season 1 Episode 2
Kanakuk Institute Podcast
Discipleship Part 1
Show Notes Transcript

In this episode, Chad and Keith examine the great commission in Matthew 28:19-20. They lay out the first three aspects of discipleship that Jesus describes.

If you'd like to learn more about discipleship, check out this resource!

Intro (Keith): Welcome to the Kanakuk Institute podcast, where we continue to equip leaders with biblical skills for a lifetime of ministry.

 

Chad: Well welcome back to another edition of the Kanakuk Institute Podcast. As always, Chad Hampsch here with Keith Chancey in studio today, talking about discipleship and what does discipleship look like. And so often we can jump into what man thinks discipleship is. We’re going to, as always at the institute, focus on, “What does God’s word have to say about discipleship?” And so, we’ll be looking at Matthew 28:18019 and really identifying six principles of discipleship. So, Keith, welcome back into studio. Excited to talk about this topic of discipleship. Would you just walk us through, really quickly, why this particular passage has been important to you, and then we’re gonna kind of break down the text in how we can apply that to discipleship today.

 

Keith: You know, I can’t think of anything that’s in greater need in our world today, than discipleship. You know, it seems like its one of those things that everyone talks about and that everyone talks about that they’re doing, but it seems like we’re not truly equipping men and women the way that they should be equipped. That they can handle accurately the word of truth, that they can evangelize, that they know how to look at scripture and interpret scripture rightly, that they keep things in context. Because it seems like in today’s world, everybody wants the bible to say what they want it to say, and what they want it to mean, rather than what the bible really does say. So Chad I really appreciate, you know, the opportunity to talk about this incredible text that I believe that Jesus himself is the author here. You know, and he tells us something very very important, and I think the first-I don’t know- the quality of discipleship is understanding the go part. So in Matthew 28:19, or in 18, when it says, “Go, therefore, and make disciples,” You know, we can’t go and do something if we don’t know what it is that we’re about to go do. And so, I think it all comes back to understanding redemption, that Jesus Christ died on the cross. It’s what we’ve always known: John 3:16, “For God so loved the world that he gave his only begotten son, that whosoever believes in him would not perish, but have everlasting life.” Well we always want the everlasting life, without the cost that it cost to get it, and then to really realize that there’s only one way to heaven. It’s not many ways. It’s one way. There’s a broad path, there’s a narrow path. But the broad path leads to destruction, and the narrow path leads to salvation. What is it that I need to understand? Well, the go part. The go part is that Jesus Christ was born of a virgin. He’s the one that was the fulfillment of prophecies all the way back to Isaiah.. Micah. He was the one that would be born in Bethlehem. And he was the one that would become the lamb sacrifice for all humanity. That he would be the one that would be the perfect God-man that was without sin – Hebrews 4:15 – without win. And that he would be the one that would go to the cross, die on the cross, and not just die, but he would resurrect on the third day. We all celebrate Christmas, we celebrate Easter, but many of us will celebrate without, really, the understanding of why we celebrate. We’re more inclined for gifts and Easter bunnies rather than the why behind what we believe. I believe Jesus Christ is the son of God, that he died on the cross, he rose from the grave, and my life is radically changed because of that. And because of what HE has done, I want to go to the world, and I want to tell the world about this Jesus. And so, the go part is easy when I understand the why: that Jesus Christ died.

 

Chad: Keith, that is so good, and for those of y’all that have your bible in front of you at home, we’re working through Matthew chapter 28, and, Keith, what I hear you saying is really the first principle of effective discipleship is the go, but for, really, for us to understand the go, we have to really understand the why. Am I hearing you accurately?

 

Keith: Absolutely, Chad, and what’s so great about that is, the why is – in myself, I’m a sinner, and I don’t know if we all get that. You know, we say that often, “Oh yeah, I’m a sinner” but do you really understand what it means to sin and who you’re sinning against? I’m sinning against the almighty God, who loved me so much that he died on the cross for me. And that my salvation is a gift, it’s a free gift, its not a result of works. And I don’t boast about what I do. I boast about what he did. And everything he’s given me is a gift. And so, Chad, when I get that, it makes me want to go and tell people about this Jesus. And so, it’s very important that I understand the repentant part, you know, that God forgave me of my sins. And when I understand that he forgave me. Let me back up for just a second and say this. I think like David. David was a man after God’s own heart. And when David, who was, Gosh, in everybody’s eyes, he’s just the perfect guy. And then, he falls to Bathsheba. Well, when he falls to Bathsheba, he has a- it’s only he’s just peeping over the walls, he’s looking at a woman bathing. So it’s just a little peep show problem at first that ends up becoming a murderous, slanderous cover-up. And, we don’t really thing that our sin sometimes could ever grow to that magnitude, yet for David it did. And then David writes a psalm that I have forever been impressed with. And it touches my heart. Psalm 32. That David writes, “When I remained silent about my sin, my body began to wither away. Chad, I don’t know if I can recover from that. Because, that’s how I feel when I sin, that my body feels like it’s withering away. And I feel shame, guilt, confusion, anger, all these words that I hate about myself. I’ve felt them all. But David addressed this issue after he writes Psalm 32, he writes Psalm 51, and he addresses this issue, and he say, “Create in me a clean heart, O God, and renew a right Spirit within me. Cast me not away from thy presence, but restore unto me the joy of salvation.” Wow! That right there brings tears to my eyes, because salvation had nothing to do with me. It had everything to do with Jesus loving me. 

 

Chad: Keith, what a great reminder that we so often, I think, in our life can think that when we sin, we’re not hurting anybody. And we don’t actually realize we’re hurting ourselves because we’re breaking the heart of God. And such a great perspective from David to understand that our distance from God becomes so great when we have the weight of sin unconfessed in our life, and so I hear you saying, when we think about the idea of discipleship, we want to go, there’s a desire to go, there’s even a passion to go, but if that going is not couched in an accurate picture of redemption, and in an accurate picture of forgiveness of God, and really in authenticity of our sin, then we can’t truly be effective in discipleship. Am I hearing you correctly?

 

Keith: That’s so well said, because, what so many of us believe is– and I think I fell into this category, I grew up in a type of church. In fact, I probably was Heinz 57 type of church because I went to all churches. And I was trying to find one thing. I wanted to find something that would allow my heart to feel freedom, and peace, and joy, because everything in my life was not joyful and peaceful at the time. Coming from a broken home, divorced family, growing up in the projects, it was not easy, and I had a chip on my shoulder about the size of Dallas. And because of that chip that was on my shoulder, I believed that religion was maybe what I was missing. So, I’d go to church, I’d pay my dues, and that, I thought, “I’ve done what I should do.” I carried my bible, but I wasn’t finding peace, I wasn’t finding joy. Something was missing. And I really began, Chad, as you said, I was searching for this go part. I wanted to go make disciples. I wanted to go do this thing, but my redemptive status hadn’t been clearly understood in myself. I didn’t truly understand what Jesus did for me. All the facts didn’t line up about his prophecies, of what he did, the fulfillment of all that. I didn’t understand the golden threads of the old testament – we’ll talk more about that later. I didn’t understand all that. That the facts were there. I was missing it because I thought I could be good enough. And so religion was what I did. I lived religiously. I was a good person, but I didn’t have a relationship. See, you know, Chad, religion is doing the do’s and the don’t’s, and a relationship is doing the “I want to’s”. And until I could have that personal relationship with Jesus, I never, it was not a “I want to” deal, it was I had to do this and that. And so I kept failing. And so I… the cycle of sin, Uh! It was awful for me, because I cycled in sin for so long because I didn’t understand clearly the relationship that I had with Jesus Christ.\

 

Chad: That’s so good. And we’ll circle back in just a couple minutes on that relationship idea. So, as we work through the passage, we’ve identified go being a key word, and the idea that our going is not just simply a motivation or a passion, but it’s really tied in redemption and reconciliation and forgiveness. So the next stage that I think a lot of us wrestle with is, “Ok, I have the desire to go, my relationship with God is in a good place. How do I make?” Help us understand, “How do I do it?” How do I actually, the nuts and bolts, how do I make a disciple?

 

Keith: That’s right, and you know, and I don’t believe you can do the second until you’ve understood the first. And if it’s not real in you, you’re never going to reproduce anything in anybody else, because there’s always going to be this feeling of, “I don’t know what to say, I don’t know what to do.” But when you are a Christian that loves Jesus, and you really do have a love, you may not know a lot yet, you see, so many of us say, “I can’t do discipleship until I know more.” That’s not all the way true. Because I believe that the thief on the cross had a great ministry in the 30 seconds that he lived after he confessed to Jesus, and Jesus said, “today you’ll be with me in paradise.” And so, it’s the moment of salvation that’s the most important part. After that moment, now it’s what I do with what I have. My toolbox may only have a screwdriver in it, but I can still go screw some screws into the wall. You’ve got to use what God has given to you. And so, just because I don’t know all the answers yet, doesn’t eliminate my responsibility. And so, now, the next step to make disciples: love people well. I just need to love people. I think so often what we do is we’ll walk into a restaurant and we will treat a waitress or waiter exactly like that, rather than seeing them as someone very significant. And I think that’s the way we do friendships and we do people that we think, we treat them in a certain way. Some we compare ourselves to, some we treat lesser because we’re better than them - so we think. And so, until we understand what it is that we’re trying to do with everybody, we’re going to continue to fail because we don’t understand everybody in this world is someone that God could use us to help make a disciple. And it’s not the amount of the time. It’s the quality of the time. People oftentimes confuse quantity with quality. “We need to spend more time with this person, if I just had more time.” You know what? It’s taking advantage of the minute, the seconds that you have with a person. Asking a person, “Hey, how are you? What’s your story? Let’s talk” And because I’ve earned the right to be heard, they’re going to want to spend time with me. I don’t need to go tell people that I need to disciple them. They’re going to ask me to disciple them because they hear the love that I have for them, and they’re going to want what I have. Because the word of God is fresh in my life, and when the living waters are there within me, People want to be around that Chad.

 

Chad: Yeah, that’s so good. That’s so good. So, we’ve really kind of talked about three major things so far in this Matthew chapter 28 passage. It says, “Go, therefore, and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit.” So we focused on the go, right? That I have a desire to go, I want to make a difference, I want to raise up the next generation, but for me to truly be a goer, I need to understand redemption. I need to be healthy in my relationship with God before I can move forward.

 

Keith: And redemption, that’s a big word, that means blood. It’s the blood of Jesus. And that leads me to repentance. 

 

Chad: So, I understand that repentance and forgiveness that comes from Christ, which is really kind of the second layer and the then, third thing we’re talking about is, “What does it mean to make?” And what I hear you saying is, “I’ve got to have purpose in discipleship.” I can spend 10 hours with somebody and not be purposeful, or I can spend 2 minutes with somebody and be incredibly purposeful. And so how we use our time in discipleship is really really important.

 

Keith: Everybody is significant. I love what Matthew 22:37-39 says. It says, “This is the greatest commandment. Love the Lord your God with all your heart, soul, mind, and strength.” Second commandment, just as important as the first commandment: Love your neighbor as yourself. And until I made myself for who God made me to be, I’ll never love others. Because I’ll always be comparing myself. Chad, the making part is a natural overflow of your life. That if you truly love God, you’re gonna love people, and you’re gonna want to be in the bible, and you’re always gonna have a word on your heart, and you’re gonna want to share that with others. And when you read a Proverbs today and you want to share it with somebody. It’s not going to be something that’s forced, it’s gonna come naturally out of your mouth, because it’s coming from your heart. It’s called a relationship. No longer religion. It’s no longer me forcing something that’s not there. It’s me living something that is there: Jesus.

 

Chad: That’s so good, and what a great reminder, and what a great way to end part 1 of our discipleship series. That reminder that when we love God, that the overflow of loving God is that we love others, and we see others as valuable. Keith that’s a great point and a great place to stop for today. So reminder: we’re looking at Matthew 28:19-20, this is part one of our series on discipleship. Next time together, we’ll come back, and we’re gonna look at three more points that are laid out in the book of Matthew that talk about the how’s, the why’s, and the when’s of discipleship, so we’ll see you next time for our two part series on Discipleship today.